The Student Room Group

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hubarasfrog

Most of the clients are guilty. Many of the judges have very old fashioned ideas about provocative dressing and actions, and this doesn't help. Girls have all their dirty laundry aired in public and this puts them off. If a few innocent people go to jail and more guilty ones are caught then it is sad, but better than having rapists on the loose.


How do you know most are guilty? And that the judges have those ideas, even in 2005? I agree about the crimes perhaps not being reported enough, but what your saying aboutl trials, i'm not convinced
Reply 181
md_red_uk
long threads :smile:

lol....your good. :smile:
Reply 182
Discrimmination against ginger people!
hubarabsprog
Yes. i do. They take tax apyers money. They get their benefis then streight down the bookies/ pub. I've seen it with my own eyes.
if we got rid of all benefits apart from disabilty and pensions it would be better.


Oh so they arent allowed down the bookies? Or the pub? Thats giving money to enterprise,isnt it?You discount people who genuinley cant get a job, have mental/physical illness, etc...just cos they go down the bookies or the pub doesnt mean you know anything about their circumstances. The royal family take a fat load of taxpayers money to lead the life of riley, and thats considerably more offensive. Anyway loads of people working on crap wages can make more on benefits than they can working-so some arent saints and play the system, so what? What would you do given no options?
naivesincerity
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How do you know most are guilty? And that the judges have those ideas, even in 2005? I agree about the crimes perhaps not being reported enough, but what your saying aboutl trials, i'm not convinced

Most judges are old, white men from upper/upper middle class backgrounds. The avergae age for judges is in the late 50s. They do still have these ideas. It has been ideentified as a problem, and there seems to be little that can be done about it.
Reply 185
naivesincerity
Is that a way of saying that your fit, but not admitting that you enjoy it? :biggrin: only joking my dearest...
I have a friend who loves that when it happens in london, maybe shes just honest :rolleyes:



:mad: don't upset me darling...

i am absolutely revolted by the fact that some horrible lecherous old man thinks he has a right to shount comments at me from across the street. aside from the fact that it happens whether i'm going out or have just rolled out of bed, hungover and ready to fall into lectures,i feel really unsafe if i'm on my own and someone does that. it's not even like i'm gorgeous or anything, its one of the things i REALLY HATE about the city...

greenpeace have their heart in the right place (sort of) but they are misinformed most of the time and are willing to get violent; i have a problem with this

fox hunting protesters are completely oblivious to the problems farmers face if the fox population gets out of control. if they would prefer, they can catch them live and give them a leathal injection for all i care, but that is ridiculously expensive unless the next government are willing to subsidise... doubtful

i didn't advocate boarding schools, i said it was an option, but i've been thinking about it, i don't think i want kids; i'd like to keep my figure....:smile:
naivesincerity
Oh so they arent allowed down the bookies? Or the pub? Thats giving money to enterprise,isnt it?You discount people who genuinley cant get a job, have mental/physical illness, etc...just cos they go down the bookies or the pub doesnt mean you know anything about their circumstances. The royal family take a fat load of taxpayers money to lead the life of riley, and thats considerably more offensive. Anyway loads of people working on crap wages can make more on benefits than they can working-so some arent saints and play the system, so what? What would you do given no options?

I didlike the royals as well.
I did say that diablity benefit should be kept - they can't work so we need to support them.
I'm more for a state food programme or work for benefits as seen in the US. W would give them food and pay utiliy bills direct to the boards, so they don't have to handle the cash at all.
I think an aoption would be the privitisation of the dole. This would be welcome, unlike say the privitisation of BR which no-one wanted. The people would the have to work or they would get the benefits stopped. in theory, e have this, but there are so many loop holes it's not happening.
i once spoke to a seniro conservative shaddow minister who agreed that something had to be done, beacuse welfare to work was turning out to be a white elephant. This is one instance where the private sector might succeed - unlike trains or health. it seems that where a comodity is involved, rather than a service (BR,NHS,etc) then the private sector succeeds. If a publci service has to be delivered, than it often fails. But take the dole and the people on it as commodities then a private company might do wonders. I'm not aware of anyone offering this kind of service in the UK, but I image that Capita or Jarvis could do something.
M-J
lol....your good. :smile:



i have to lengthen this message by at least 4 characters... so :smile:
hubarabsprog

I think an aoption would be the privitisation of the dole. This would be welcome, unlike say the privitisation of BR which no-one wanted. The people would the have to work or they would get the benefits stopped. in theory, e have this, but there are so many loop holes it's not happening.
i once spoke to a seniro conservative shaddow minister who agreed that something had to be done, beacuse welfare to work was turning out to be a white elephant. This is one instance where the private sector might succeed - unlike trains or health. it seems that where a comodity is involved, rather than a service (BR,NHS,etc) then the private sector succeeds. If a publci service has to be delivered, than it often fails. But take the dole and the people on it as commodities then a private company might do wonders. I'm not aware of anyone offering this kind of service in the UK, but I image that Capita or Jarvis could do something.


I dont follow this...whats the point of benefits that support the employed but not the unemployed?? And why is the dole not a public service? Wheres the evidence here that privatising it would be beneficial in the slightest?
naivesincerity
I dont follow this...whats the point of benefits that support the employed but not the unemployed?? And why is the dole not a public service? Wheres the evidence here that privatising it would be beneficial in the slightest?


What are you missing?
Where did I say benefits for the employed?
It is not a public service as it does nothing for the majorty of people. most people will use the NHS, most people will take a train or a bus. Most people will not use the dole.
What evidience do you want. it is happeing across a large neumber of American States - if it didn't work why would they do it?
What the idea is is this: Government pays company a certain ammount. The company has to pay the dole (at a government appointed rate0 and make a profit. Only way to do that is to get people into work. Theey are forced into work on the threat of termination of payment, and part of their wages goes towards paying back the dole they have had, thus making money for the company. If they do not work, they loose the money and have to fend for themselves.
in theory the state could do it, but the profit incentive of a private company makes more sense.
Reply 190
hubarabsprog
What are you missing?
Where did I say benefits for the employed?
It is not a public service as it does nothing for the majorty of people. most people will use the NHS, most people will take a train or a bus. Most people will not use the dole.
What evidience do you want. it is happeing across a large neumber of American States - if it didn't work why would they do it?
What the idea is is this: Government pays company a certain ammount. The company has to pay the dole (at a government appointed rate0 and make a profit. Only way to do that is to get people into work. Theey are forced into work on the threat of termination of payment, and part of their wages goes towards paying back the dole they have had, thus making money for the company. If they do not work, they loose the money and have to fend for themselves.
in theory the state could do it, but the profit incentive of a private company makes more sense.


that makes sense, and if i can find a job, i expect a good proportion of people on benefits could too
Reply 191
md_red_uk
long threads :smile:


hehe! I apologise for starting this one then.... :wink:


adding another to the list: tuition fees. (if and when they are put into action - the year i go to uni. lucky me!)
hubarabsprog
What are you missing?
Where did I say benefits for the employed?
It is not a public service as it does nothing for the majorty of people. most people will use the NHS, most people will take a train or a bus. Most people will not use the dole.
What evidience do you want. it is happeing across a large neumber of American States - if it didn't work why would they do it?
What the idea is is this: Government pays company a certain ammount. The company has to pay the dole (at a government appointed rate0 and make a profit. Only way to do that is to get people into work. Theey are forced into work on the threat of termination of payment, and part of their wages goes towards paying back the dole they have had, thus making money for the company. If they do not work, they loose the money and have to fend for themselves.
in theory the state could do it, but the profit incentive of a private company makes more sense.


To me its an unnessecary complication...the workers would have to pay back significantly MORE than they got on the dole to give the company a decent profit. and how long do they get dole for then, if they lose the money at a certain point? A state run service is no less efficient..they can run time checks and make sure people make adequate effort to work...all privitisation does is contradict what benefits are about, ie state provision for the poor, and hand over everything to a profit making organisation that doesnt give a **** for the poor, which would, as you propose it be run under government guidlines anyway. And the evidence you provide is that its used all over America? And? So are the death penalty, and private healthcare, and legalised guns, i dont see them as great successes...I have no desire for us to emulate the states in any way, they are a hugely divided country
medic_bex
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fox hunters are completely oblivious to the problems farmers face if the fox population gets out of control. if they would prefer, they can catch them live and give them a leathal injection for all i care, but that is ridiculously expensive unless the next government are willing to subsidise... doubtful
:smile:


you misunderstood, i'm anti hunting, not pro
medic_bex
that makes sense, and if i can find a job, i expect a good proportion of people on benefits could too


People on benefits dont have a levels and a few years medical degree behind them....
Reply 195
naivesincerity
To me its an unnessecary complication...the workers would have to pay back significantly MORE than they got on the dole to give the company a decent profit. and how long do they get dole for then, if they lose the money at a certain point?

surely this would motivate them to get a proper job. they would end up paying the deficit as if repaying a loan and in all likelyhood, it would have the same 15year get-out clause that student loans do. so if you haven't repayed the debt after 15 years, the contract is nullified and the debt disappears
Reply 196
naivesincerity
you misunderstood, i'm anti hunting, not pro


yeah actually, that deserves an edit, i'm pro hunting...

and if i can work my ass off to get into uni, i don't see why others can't do the same!

but i don't even mean that, i've been a junior hairdresser, worked in starbucks and been an events waitress. i have 2 jobs and i'm at uni full time! sometimes its a bitch but i'm not doing it for the good of my health!
medic_bex
surely this would motivate them to get a proper job.


And if they cant? You two just have a very cliched and over-cynical take on people on the dole, i believe, and privatisation is no the way to deal with it IMO. You seem to assume everyone on state beneifts isnt motivated to get a job, but what if they can't?. The state benfit system doesnt allow people just to say"i dont fancy working" they give them jobs and have to prove they are trying to.I believe in a capitalist world, there will always be people on the bottom who suffer, this is why we need state benefits
medic_bex
yeah actually, that deserves an edit, i'm pro hunting...

and if i can work my ass off to get into uni, i don't see why others can't do the same!
!


Because thats the nature of society!!! You cant have a society where everyone makes equal earnings, and no-ones poor, unless you believe in the kind of socialism that cripples the economy..if the economy is to prosper, and the country is to get more wealthy, we need capitalism, which means wealth division and some people left poor, hence we need good state services too,including benefits
hubarabsprog
Yes. i do. They take tax apyers money. They get their benefis then streight down the bookies/ pub. I've seen it with my own eyes.
if we got rid of all benefits apart from disabilty and pensions it would be better.

I hope you know that a lot more of tax payers money is lost through tax fraud than is lost through benefit fraud. A lot more. I can't remember the exact amounts and I don't think it's right for me to try and guess.
People who are living on state benefits are simply used as scapegoats. Although I admit (obviously) that any fraud is wrong it's just that if you're taking the view that these people are majoroly affecting the economy then you should also look at those further up the social ladder who do this on a much greater scale... especially those at the very top.

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